why do we only want steph to kiss the boys younger than her
Not sure, tbh.
But seriously. MilesSteph. Batgirl and Spiderman as partners, trading stories about their struggles with gravity, getting soda during a long patrol, commiserating over wonderful but impossible to live up to predecessors. The world is not ready for that level of adorable.
Context: Daughter’s of Cain excerpt. Cass and Steph have just spent the past three hours evacuating a partially collapsed building in Gotham after the quake. They’ve just met, and Cass hasn’t even realized Steph is mute yet.
A glass bottle of juice was thrust into her face. Cass looked up to see her rescue partner grinning at her, eyebrow cocked.
“Thank you,” Cass said fervently, taking the bottle and twisting the top off. The other girl shrugged, sitting down next to Cass and taking a drink from her own bottle. Cass closed her eyes. She was hot, and tired, and it felt so good to sit down…
…She woke up with her head pillowed on the other girls shoulder. The sun had set, and the dim glimmer of stars could be seen in the night sky. Cass shivered. The light pollution from the city drowned out the stars, normally. It wasn’t right to see them this deep in the interior.
rough sketches, messing around & looking for an easily animateable style that… isn’t totally timm/dcau. idk how i manage it but i always have this feeling like a) i am really inconsistent and have no style of my own and b) everything i draw looks the same
contradictory statements lol… hrnnnmmm.
At first glance I thought this was Artemis (Pony-tail + sideview of eye looking dark-colored) and had a moment of what, wha? And then I realized it was Steph and felt like an idiot.
Because as cute as the idea of Jack/Tim is, Tim’s much more a creature of fear than snow.
And Cass spent almost a decade running, looking for a way to atone for what she’d done.
And Steph walked on eggshells around her parents as a child, because she there was no consistency in her family.
And Jason watched his mother die by inches and ended up on the street.
And Damian got pushed too far, too soon.
They’re all shaped by fear. It was the crucible that formed their identities. Tim’s fear drove him to be exacting, precise, always with a backup plan and a list of possibly contingencies. Cass’s fear gave her a purity of purpose, a single-minded determination to never kill again. Steph’s fear made her resilient, capable of getting up and going on in the face of seemingly insurmountable barriers. Jason’s fear taught him compassion and righteous fury, seeing himself in the faces of other victims and survivors. Damian’s fear is still so much a part of him he can’t acknowledge it, or see past it, but he’s learning too, taking chances on people, opening up despite his past experiences.
Fear isn’t an enemy. It’s an ally. It’s the restraining hand that keeps you from diving off a cliff because it looks fun. Fear’s a guard and a guide, the loyal second who asks if that’s really the best course of action.
And Pitch is proud of his Gotham brats. Gotham’s one of the last places children really do still believe in the bogey man. Gotham is Pitch’s city, and he’s practically the batclan’s patron saint.
I really hate this sales argument. Now admittedly, I’m a social worker and numbers really aren’t my game but as a huge Stephanie Brown fan, I’ve followed this since the very beginning. I love Gail Simone more than any other writer in comics and she kind of isBarbara Gordon in my eyes - so I’m not going to dispute the sales of the New52 Batgirl title. Of course it’s selling more copies than Steph’s run did. You have the more ‘iconic’ Batgirl (I use that term intentionally) written by a writer that openly adores the character. It’s exciting for anyone who is a fan of Simone OR Gordon (of which I am both).
Everything I have read though clearly states that although Steph’s Batgirl sales might not have been stellar, it sold more issues than some of the New52 titles that continue to be commissioned.
Which by itself may not be that convincing, BUT when you consider how much hype there has been around the New52 titles I become a little more convinced. We’ll never know what Miller’s Batgirl series might have sold if it had received even one tenth of the marketing and promotion the New52 has. I can’t take two steps in my comic store without the words New52 in my face - even when Steph’s run was current, I had to dig for my issues.
More so, I think what this person’s reply shows, is that fans just aren’t buying what DC is selling when it comes to Steph & Cass. Their ‘reasons’ for refusing to allow multiple writers who have expressed interest to introduce either Cass or Steph back into the DCnU just don’t quite compute. And we’re not talking about some newbie writers here without a track record of success. We’re talking about some of DC (and comics) very best. Moves like making Nguyen change the hair color only add to the ‘lore’ that Steph & Cass’s so-called toxicity is becoming.
What I hate most about all of this is that so many fans are using this as an excuse to hate on Babs and her current run of Batgirl. Simone is a fantastic writer and no one writes Barbara as well. She IS the original and Cass & Steph might not have ever existed without her. Refusing to support this series does not bring us closer to having Cass and/or Steph back - in fact, if anything, it probably just serves to prove DC’s (or DiDio’s?) point.
I realize I’m ‘just a fan’ but I’m not just jumping on a soapbox. I could write a thesis on why Steph stands out in the Batfamily for me (perhaps not as eloquently as some others already have) and I think I speak for many fans when I say I miss her (and Cass) terribly. That said, I care about the overall well-being of the comic industry more than I do one (or two) characters. The problem is - DC hasn’t really proven that to me yet. Frankly, they almost seem to play into the hype (ie. pulling the YJ episode, Smallville etc etc) and that feels disrespectful to to us fans.
We will probably never know the whole truth but I think DC has done an atrocious job of handling this and yes, it’s left me feeling a little bitter.
Reblogged for commentary.
In regards to ‘using this as an excuse to hate on Babs and her current run of Batgirl’-
That’s not a fair judgement. If you like the current Batgirl series, great. More power to you. But I don’t like it, and I’m not obliged to like it. Cass and Steph are part of that, but I have other issues beyond that. Even if I didn’t, I’m not required to justify why I don’t like the run or the current incarnation of the character. I don’t like it, and that is sufficient.
I do not owe Simone, Babs, or Batgirl my money or my approval. If the erasure of Cass and Steph sour fans on Babs enough they don’t want to read her run, that’s completely within their rights. It’s not an ‘excuse’, it’s an honest statement of their thoughts and feelings. You are not required to come up with an excuse for feeling annoyed and angry over the erasure of beloved characters, or for feeling annoyance and anger at the character they were erased in favor of.
Every time someone talks about how BQM loves and respects Steph I just have to stare at them.
No. No, I really don’t think he does.
If he did, he wouldn’t dismiss and demean her history as a vigilante. He wouldn’t whitewash her past. He wouldn’t carelessly excise her brutality and ruthlessness and anger. He wouldn’t ignore her skills and experience. He wouldn’t abandon her ties not only to her best friend, but to her mentors.
He would write Stephanie Brown. Not a watered down substitute he finds more palatable, who fits more neatly into the boxes he wants to present.
It’s a shame that his depiction of Steph as Batgirl is the only one we’re going to get.
I will never get over how poorly BQM wrote not only Steph, but also her relationships with other vigilantes, particularly Cass (or the… lack of writing that relationship) and with Barbara. Babs was the one who stuck up for Steph after Bruce fired her as Robin and made him admit that he’d been unfair. Steph knew who Oracle was before she knew Tim’s name. Babs, and the Birds, were there for Steph, often when the core Batfam was shunning her.
I hate that BQM ignored everything that Steph achieved during her time as Spoiler and Robin. That he made Batgirl the “first thing she saw through”, that he made Batgirl the first time she was “doing this for the right reasons”, like she hadn’t come to that point within a few months of her vigilante career, when she stuck around during the quake to help people, when she realized that the suburbs needed superheroes too.
It’s like he just ticked “bubbly blonde” boxes for personality and didn’t reallylookat Steph. BQM’s Steph isn’t the Steph that nearly killed Zsasz because she’d just seen his last victim, she isn’t the Steph that tried to strangle her dad, who had to be stopped from beating the Penguin to a pulp, who stormed out of a diner because she couldn’t stand to listen to people spouting rape culture bullshit. And I loved that Steph, the one who wasn’t perfect, who was angry and a little ruthless because she’d been hurt by the world and sometimes just wanted to hurt it back.
In the end, to me, it can be summed up by that one damn little panel where BQM made Steph a Blue Lantern.
Because he’s wrong.
Steph isn’t about hope. Stephloseshope. Sometimes she loses hope because the world is so screwed up that sending a few bad guys to jail isn’t going to change anything. She sees a system that failed her, that fails hundred of other people, including little kids, and she feels hopeless.
But that doesn’t mean she’s going to stop fighting. It isn’t about hope, it’s about doing something in the face of hopelessness. Steph picks herself up even if she knows she’s going to lose again, simply because she refuses to stay down. If Steph were a Lantern, she’d be Green, and BQM just didn’t understand that.
Some really good discussion.
I started reading (haphazardly) Steph’s Batgirl run before I started reading her as Spoiler, and I did/do like it. But the more I read of Spoiler, the more I have to treat BQM’s Steph as an alternate reality version of herself. I like Batgirl-Steph, and I like Spoiler-Steph. But I don’t think they’re the same character.
It’d be kind of interesting, actually, to see Spoiler Steph and Batgirl Steph interact. (Universe collision? Batgirl Steph as Spoiler Steph’s older sister?) I like them both, as I said. And I think they’d have an awesome character dynamic- Spoiler is a bit of a Knight in Sour Armor/Anti-Nihilist, while Batgirl skews more towards Incorruptible Pure Pureness, and they’d balance each other well.
…I’m shipping a character with an alternate version of herself. Somebody take my computer away from me.
The TV: After all that Felicia has achieved for herself in the last three seasons- as a professional and as a person- we felt that reducing her to nothing more than a victim of rape was totally unacceptable.
Steph (furious): Reduce? Nothing more than a-?
(She stands up) WAITRESS!
Waitress: Huh? What’s wrong?
Steph: Can you turn that idiotic plastic thing off? Or change the channel?
Waitress: Sorry, miss. The regulars watch Entertainment Jackal every day. Can’t do it.
Steph (slamming down her money, jerking her thumb): C’mon, Tim, let’s go somewhere else.
So can I talk about my love for this page? It’s a clear demonstration of rape culture and how it affects and triggers people. Steph is unabashedly, unashamedly furious to hear the media casually dehumanize rape victims, and she fucking makes a scene about it. She will not sit here and listen to this shit, she will call it out. It’s clear that this sort of subtle language hurts her and triggers her, and she won’t stand for it.
IDK, I guess this sort of thing is why Steph is important to me and distinctive from the bevy of blondes and I would never say she has a generic personality. She is deeply, deeply connected to abuse and she is well aware how much of it is due to her class, her gender, her background and she internalizes it deeply- but she also really fights against it, and her entire life story is refusing to let abuse or the culture she lives in dehumanize her. She calls out rape culture. She’s loud and she’s angry and she’s fighting for all the people beside her are buried under this shit, because she knows she’s not the only one and she’s determined to protect people so they don’t have to go through it because she knows exactly how it feels. She’ll never give in.
Stephanie Brown means a lot to me the end.
This page is a huge part of why her later treatment made me furious enough to start Girl-Wonder.org — how DARE dc comics take this voice and kill her via three months of extremely sexualised and horrifying torture? How fucking dare they?
okay but so we’re all aware that this is a dig at the writers of felicity specifically thought right
because i just
it makes me
OH YES I forgot to mention that
Yeah there’s actually a really good interview with Jon Lewis about this issue and he admits that this page was in response to the statements made by the writers of Felicity because they really pissed him off.
Like I said, trying to be true to this specific situation with these specific people, and not “make a statement” about an issue. However, there are a couple things I did put in there for purely rhetorical purposes. I felt I needed to point out the depressingly high percentage of women and girls who have experienced something like this, that it is unfortunately not a rare phenomenon.
Also, sometime early this year I read a bit in the entertainment section of the newspaper about how the season finale of that show “Felicity” had been scrapped, because it had Felicity being sexually assaulted. The producers asked for a totally new episode, and released a press statement saying, “we felt that after all this character has achieved for herself professionally and personally, to reduce her to nothing more than a victim of rape would be totally unacceptable.”
I found that sentiment so utterly disgusting, this idea that rape strips a woman of her personhood and negates all her achievements. It stuck in my craw. Months later, when I wrote Robin # 111, I just had to put it in. There’s a scene where Steph and Tim are in a diner, and there’s a TV on in the background showing the equivalent of Entertainment Tonight, and there’s a newsbit where that press release is read almost verbatim. Obviously, that’s something that is in the story only because as the author I wanted to ridicule and revile it. But otherwise I tried hard to just tell the story, be inside the characters